VAR Discussion Thread - 2023/24 | PL clubs to vote on whether to scrap VAR (pg413)

Would you want VAR scrapped?


  • Total voters
    293
  • Poll closed .
They do though, they literally give him a screen to run over and check something from all angles. Let’s not forget they do get the correct outcome the vast majority of times - it doesn’t feel like it though because of the (justified) uproar when they don’t.
They get sent to the screen to overturn a decision. If they were sent to the screen (or decided to go to the screen) to check marginal decisions then your point might be valid. But they only go to the screen when being advised to change a decision.
 
You can shout corruption as much as you like but that’s horse shit too and I’ve never dismissed your opinion so wind your neck in .ive never said it isn’t corrupt but have no proof specifically so if city have they should take action to bring it to the public domain
Using the term Conspiracy Theory is dismissive. A term first coined by the C.I.A. to destroy the credibility of anybody who disagreed with official narrative surrounding the assassination of JFK. Less than 35% of American now believe the Lee Harvey Oswald magic bullet official version of events now. Looks like the very first Conspiracy Theorists were correct.
 
Using the term Conspiracy Theory is dismissive. A term first coined by the C.I.A. to destroy the credibility of anybody who disagreed with official narrative surrounding the assassination of JFK. Less than 35% of American now believe the Lee Harvey Oswald magic bullet official version of events now. Looks like the very first Conspiracy Theorists were correct.
If the majority of Americans don't believe it, I'm inclined to think its true.
 
This sounds like an absolutely shit idea.


So instead of recognising VAR isn't working for the important decisions far too often, and taking steps to change that, the powers that be have decided to deflect from that issue and involve VAR in the every-day decisions which individually are generally not game changing.

This is just one step away from removing the on field officials completely, which some might think is a good thing.

I was an advocate for VAR initially, I truly believed that it would remove "clear and obvious" errors from the game, and I still do believe, if it was employed by capable people for that reason it could bring benefit, but this latest hair-brained cockamamie "plan" and I use that term loosely, has shifted me firmly into the scrap it altogether camp
 
Just seen that PSG penalty decision - Do they have different laws in champions league with handball ? The ref clearly saw on the monitor that it comes off his chest onto his arm, absolutely no way would that have been given in the Prem
 
The over-zealous interference is ruining the game now, they've gone too far with it.

If they are going to keep it they need to go the route of tennis and cricket and make it a challenge system. If you have a problem with a goal or decision the manager gets a challenge, get it wrong and you lose it.

Every 3 days there is an absolute howler.
 
Just seen that PSG penalty decision - Do they have different laws in champions league with handball ? The ref clearly saw on the monitor that it comes off his chest onto his arm, absolutely no way would that have been given in the Prem

Different interpretations:
 
Just seen that PSG penalty decision - Do they have different laws in champions league with handball ? The ref clearly saw on the monitor that it comes off his chest onto his arm, absolutely no way would that have been given in the Prem

To me a big issue here as well is the on field referees appear terrified to go against the VAR team. So they get called over to look at an incident and then bottle it and just go with whatever VAR has said.

Firslty fuck knows what the VAR team were thinking calling it over for a review anyway, then secondly the ref should have the fortitude to stand by his original decision instead of falling like a deck of cards.
 
Human error in real time is forgivable. Human error after watching an incident several times in slo-mo is definitely not.
Goal line technology and an upgraded way of calling offsides is all that’s required imo.
Everything else is just taking away from what the game is about.

I agree now, goal line technology and offside's are the only things that should be aided by technology.
 
To me a big issue here as well is the on field referees appear terrified to go against the VAR team. So they get called over to look at an incident and then bottle it and just go with whatever VAR has said.

Firslty fuck knows what the VAR team were thinking calling it over for a review anyway, then secondly the ref should have the fortitude to stand by his original decision instead of falling like a deck of cards.

By UEFA rules the ref had to give the pen.
 
By UEFA rules the ref had to give the pen.
No, he didn't. These are the IFAB Laws of the Game regarding handball;

Handling the ball For the purposes of determining handball offences, the upper boundary of the arm is in line with the bottom of the armpit. Not every touch of a player’s hand/arm with the ball is an offence. It is an offence if a player:
•  deliberately touches the ball with their hand/arm, for example moving the hand/arm towards the ball
•  touches the ball with their hand/arm when it has made their body unnaturally bigger. A player is considered to have made their body unnaturally bigger when the position of their hand/arm is not a consequence of, or justifiable by, the player’s body movement for that specific situation. By having their hand/arm in such a position, the player takes a risk of their hand/arm being hit by the ball and being penalised
• scores in the opponents’ goal: • directly from their hand/arm, even if accidental, including by the goalkeeper
• immediately after the ball has touched their hand/arm, even if accidental
The goalkeeper has the same restrictions on handling the ball as any other player outside the penalty area. If the goalkeeper handles the ball inside their penalty area when not permitted to do so, an indirect free kick is awarded but there is no disciplinary sanction. However, if the offence is playing the ball a second time (with or without the hand/arm) after a restart before it touches another player, the goalkeeper must be sanctioned if the offence stops a promising attack or denies an opponent or the opposing team a goal or an obvious goal-scoring opportunity.

I can't find a written copy of UEFA's guidelines but at the end of last season they had a meeting to discuss clarification of various rules, one of these was the handball rule. Their press release afterwards stated that in the 23/24 season they stated that "• In their guidelines for the next season, the Board recommends that UEFA should clarify that no handball offence should be called on a player if the ball is previously deflected from his own body and, in particular, when the ball does not go towards the goal."

The referee was asked to take a look at it on the monitor for whatever reason (I'm guessing the clear and obvious thing doesn't apply consistently) then because the VAR guy decided that the defenders arm was in an unnatural position then he had to give it. The VAR guy either ignored or had a different interpretation of the part of the law that states "A player is considered to have made their body unnaturally bigger when the position of their hand/arm is not a consequence of, or justifiable by, the player’s body movement for that specific situation".

What has actually happened here is the referee made the right call, the VAR team decided to use the strictest, most narrow and incorrect view of the Law disregarding what it was originally written for and then the referee has felt under pressure to use the VAR version of the Laws.

The ref absolutely did not have to give that penalty under UEFA or anybody elses rules. He made the right decision then somebody else got involved and the wrong decision was made.
 
No, he didn't. These are the IFAB Laws of the Game regarding handball;

Handling the ball For the purposes of determining handball offences, the upper boundary of the arm is in line with the bottom of the armpit. Not every touch of a player’s hand/arm with the ball is an offence. It is an offence if a player:
•  deliberately touches the ball with their hand/arm, for example moving the hand/arm towards the ball
•  touches the ball with their hand/arm when it has made their body unnaturally bigger. A player is considered to have made their body unnaturally bigger when the position of their hand/arm is not a consequence of, or justifiable by, the player’s body movement for that specific situation. By having their hand/arm in such a position, the player takes a risk of their hand/arm being hit by the ball and being penalised
• scores in the opponents’ goal: • directly from their hand/arm, even if accidental, including by the goalkeeper
• immediately after the ball has touched their hand/arm, even if accidental
The goalkeeper has the same restrictions on handling the ball as any other player outside the penalty area. If the goalkeeper handles the ball inside their penalty area when not permitted to do so, an indirect free kick is awarded but there is no disciplinary sanction. However, if the offence is playing the ball a second time (with or without the hand/arm) after a restart before it touches another player, the goalkeeper must be sanctioned if the offence stops a promising attack or denies an opponent or the opposing team a goal or an obvious goal-scoring opportunity.

I can't find a written copy of UEFA's guidelines but at the end of last season they had a meeting to discuss clarification of various rules, one of these was the handball rule. Their press release afterwards stated that in the 23/24 season they stated that "• In their guidelines for the next season, the Board recommends that UEFA should clarify that no handball offence should be called on a player if the ball is previously deflected from his own body and, in particular, when the ball does not go towards the goal."

The referee was asked to take a look at it on the monitor for whatever reason (I'm guessing the clear and obvious thing doesn't apply consistently) then because the VAR guy decided that the defenders arm was in an unnatural position then he had to give it. The VAR guy either ignored or had a different interpretation of the part of the law that states "A player is considered to have made their body unnaturally bigger when the position of their hand/arm is not a consequence of, or justifiable by, the player’s body movement for that specific situation".

What has actually happened here is the referee made the right call, the VAR team decided to use the strictest, most narrow and incorrect view of the Law disregarding what it was originally written for and then the referee has felt under pressure to use the VAR version of the Laws.

The ref absolutely did not have to give that penalty under UEFA or anybody elses rules. He made the right decision then somebody else got involved and the wrong decision was made.

you've missed off the key bit.
"• In their guidelines for the next season, the Board recommends that UEFA should clarify that no handball offence should be called on a player if the ball is previously deflected from his own body and, in particular, when the ball does not go towards the goal."

this was an independent board that suggested the above. Uefa didn't get around to actually approving it though so by the laws of the game it's handball.
 
I’m not paranoid but isn’t last nights decision following the usual UEFA agenda - they WANT PSG; Madrid; Barca; Bayern; scum; an Italian team; dippers in the knockout stages. Newcastle are suffering like we did (& still do to some extent) & are also a financial threat. Can’t let another oil club overtake the “special” ones
 
Just seen that PSG penalty decision - Do they have different laws in champions league with handball ? The ref clearly saw on the monitor that it comes off his chest onto his arm, absolutely no way would that have been given in the Prem
According to the last UEFA missive, if a ball rebounds from the body on to the arm - no penalty. Unless it’s for one of the “elite” clubs who need a bit of help
 
In April, the Uefa football board - an independent advisory group - recommended that "Uefa should clarify that no handball offence should be called on a player if the ball is previously deflected from his own body".

Keith Hackett, former general manager of the Professional Game Match Officials Limited (PGMOL), the English referees' body, told the Daily Telegraph that Uefa did not implement this recommendation for its own competitions.

"Last April, in their guidelines for the upcoming season, the Uefa board recommended that there should be clarity that no handball offence should be called on a player if the ball is previously deflected from their own body," Hackett said. "But this recommendation was not implemented - and Newcastle paid the price at the Parc des Princes."
 
yeah I know, that's because there are different rules in Uefa competitions
Can you show a copy of the different rules or guidelines that are used in UEFA competitions anywhere?
Anything other than the BBC report that ex-referee, non-UEFA employee Keith Hackett has said so?
 

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