VAR Discussion Thread - 2023/24 | PL clubs to vote on whether to scrap VAR (pg413)

[KentBlue]

Toney moved the ball to his obvious advantage, without the Ref knowing after the referee marked the spot for the free kick, scores and VAR says nothing to the ref. Another very obvious cock up by VAR in my mind.

If there is one word that most of us has used regarding the whole thing, that word is 'transparency.'
VAR may well have mentioned it to the ref but then told him to ignore it: didn't think it worthy of going through all the hassle of taking the free kick again. Then when they saw it in full they thought 'Oh, FFS!' But it was too late. Damage done.
We don't know what is said between the ref and the VAR operatives because for some reason they don't want us to know. And this shroud of secrecy has grown ever tighter around pgmol since Webb took over.

 

[Gordyola]

Millimetres isn’t blatant though, that’s the big difference.

Liverpool and Spurs could score goals well offside, make disgusting challenges and not seeing red, dive with zero contact for penalties etc without VAR.

Yep VAR has certainly improved matters on that score NOT

 

[toffee balls]

Been invited to a referees function in March and guess who is the main speaker.
Non other but the right dishonourable Howard Webb.

Get me some ammo please.

 

[Stephen230]

Toney moved the ball to his obvious advantage, without the Ref knowing after the referee marked the spot for the free kick, scores and VAR says nothing to the ref. Another very obvious cock up by VAR in my mind.

Well it isn’t a cock up because it isn’t in their jurisdiction.

There’s a case for saying maybe in cases like that they could have an unofficial word in the refs ear. But if that did ever go on, they’re probably loathed to doing it now incase it develops into something major and the audio ends up on ‘Mic’d Up’

 

[halfcenturyup]

I'd like a ten minute explanation live and an e mail to confirm

With Everton being kept properly informed and excuses given to Liverpool, I imagine?

 

[halfcenturyup]

Well it isn’t a cock up because it isn’t in their jurisdiction.

There’s a case for saying maybe in cases like that they could have an unofficial word in the refs ear. But if that did ever go on, they’re probably loathed to doing it now incase it develops into something major and the audio ends up on ‘Mic’d Up’

But you do agree it's ridiculous that offsides are measures to the mm, but VAR can't correct someone moving the ball and the referee's mark for a free-kick that is scored from? They really don't do themselves any favours with this VAR nonsense.

 

[Blue Mist]

Been invited to a referees function in March and guess who is the main speaker.
Non other but the right dishonourable Howard Webb.

Get me some ammo please.

I don't think you mean ammo in the way I do. :-)

 

[half & half derby scarf]

The VAR audio from the Spurs v Liverpool game is quite telling. The reaction when they realise they have gone against the directive to favour the red shirt teams is priceless.

 

[Stephen230]

But you do agree it's ridiculous that offsides are measures to the mm, but VAR can't correct someone moving the ball and the referee's mark for a free-kick that is scored from? They really don't do themselves any favours with this VAR nonsense.

Well the vast majority of people seem to be calling for less involvement from VAR.

But then you get a minor indiscretion like this, outside of their jurisdiction and a lot of the same people seem to be saying they should get involved.

Can’t have it both ways.

 

[halfcenturyup]

Well the vast majority of people seem to be calling for less involvement from VAR.

But then you get a minor indiscretion like this, outside of their jurisdiction and a lot of the same people seem to be saying they should get involved.

Can’t have it both ways.

A minor indiscretion?

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

Well it isn’t a cock up because it isn’t in their jurisdiction.

There’s a case for saying maybe in cases like that they could have an unofficial word in the refs ear. But if that did ever go on, they’re probably loathed to doing it now incase it develops into something major and the audio ends up on ‘Mic’d Up’

I thought they could look at all incidents that lead up to a goal. That one certainly did. And the Ref certainly didn't see it.

 

[TinFoilHat]

Toney moved the ball to his obvious advantage, without the Ref knowing after the referee marked the spot for the free kick, scores and VAR says nothing to the ref. Another very obvious cock up by VAR in my mind.

Was it a cock up?

Webb's silence is deafening.

 

[Alan Harper's Tash]

I thought they could look at all incidents that lead up to a goal. That one certainly did. And the Ref certainly didn't see it.

Players move the ball at most free kicks, whether it’s to gain 5 yards from an offside free kick or moving it sideways to get a better angle.

 

[toffee balls]

I don't think you mean ammo in the way I do. :-)

Yes I do.

 

[Stephen230]

A minor indiscretion?

Well yeah, I’d class moving the ball a few inches as minor.

If a goal came directly from a big hoof downfield from ‘keeper after an offside, would you want VAR studying if he’d taken it from exactly the right place?

 

[bluenova]

Well yeah, I’d class moving the ball a few inches as minor.

If a goal came directly from a big hoof downfield from ‘keeper after an offside, would you want VAR studying if he’d taken it from exactly the right place?

Surely what pushes it from minor indiscretion to something more, is that he moved the refs markings?

We've been told if the referee is happy where it's taken from, then that's fine, but the referee didn't know it was outside where he drew the circle.

The hoof is also a total red herring, as it makes almost no material difference to the kick. It's rare for a free kick to go in such an easy line to the goal, and usually involved someone misaligning their wall - something that almost never happens in the PL. This movement gave him a clear sight of goal, that under normal circumstances he would never have.

I'd have expected a yellow card, and the goal ruled out.

 

[halfcenturyup]

Well yeah, I’d class moving the ball a few inches as minor.

If a goal came directly from a big hoof downfield from ‘keeper after an offside, would you want VAR studying if he’d taken it from exactly the right place?

If the referee had marked it with foam and then the keeper deliberately moved the ball more than a few inches, say a foot and a half to gain an advantage around a stationary wall, and also moved the foam to con the referee, then yes I would. But you know it's not a valid comparison anyway.

 

[Stephen230]

Surely what pushes it from minor indiscretion to something more, is that he moved the refs markings?

We've been told if the referee is happy where it's taken from, then that's fine, but the referee didn't know it was outside where he drew the circle.

The hoof is also a total red herring, as it makes almost no material difference to the kick. It's rare for a free kick to go in such an easy line to the goal, and usually involved someone misaligning their wall - something that almost never happens in the PL. This movement gave him a clear sight of goal, that under normal circumstances he would never have.

I'd have expected a yellow card, and the goal ruled out.

It’s such a rare occurrence that it couldn’t possibly be specifically legislated for.

The only possible reason VAR could justify getting involved would be if they thought it came under the umbrella of:

*attacking team offence in the build-up to or scoring of the goal (handball, foul, offside etc.)•

It’s a push to interpret placing the ball as the ‘build up’ though.

One thing is for certain. If VAR had got involved, there would be a thousand clips of other free kicks all over social media this morning, where the player moved the ball slightly and the goal stood.

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

Players move the ball at most free kicks, whether it’s to gain 5 yards from an offside free kick or moving it sideways to get a better angle.

True, but it's not in the rules and if you score from it especially when it's so close and the opposition have set their wall up for that position I think it stretches what is acceptable. Imo VAR should have intervened.

 

[Alan Harper's Tash]

True, but it's not in the rules and if you score from it especially when it's so close and the opposition have set their wall up for that position I think it stretches what is acceptable. Imo VAR should have intervened.

Dale Johnson on X says VAR can’t get involved in things like this.