VAR Discussion Thread - 2023/24 | PL clubs to vote on whether to scrap VAR (pg413)

[Stephen230]

Not good enough I'm afraid.
Multiple times? Hmmmm.
Why not set the same level for all the games, regardless of which team/player is involved

It’s computer generated. It’s not a secret. Every time you see one single line instead of the normal two, it means the tolerance level has been applied.

 

[Saddleworth2]

Forget it was the Rags. Yesterday was the reason we fell hopelessly in love with this game. FA cup semi. A David vs Goliath match. A match that looked like it was dead and buried and then an amazing come-back. The tension cranked up to 10 as extra time plays out and then, unbelievably, the underdog crafts a fine move down the length of the pitch. United defenders almost out on their feet. The ball into the box and Goallllllllllllll….
The sheer ecstatic joy of that moment. A moment that will live in every Coventry supporters mind forever. Their Aguero moment…

But it’s not. Because some invisible jobsworth has decided that it’s offside. Never mind that the on-field referee awarded the goal. Certainly never mind that all the evidence presented indicates that it was impossible to tell. Never mind that the system used cannot be trusted to show fine margins.
It was a perfectly beautiful goal and now it isn’t.
Football really really needs to look hard at itself.

 

[Mr Fraser]

Forget it was the Rags. Yesterday was the reason we fell hopelessly in love with this game. FA cup semi. A David vs Goliath match. A match that looked like it was dead and buried and then an amazing come-back. The tension cranked up to 10 as extra time plays out and then, unbelievably, the underdog crafts a fine move down the length of the pitch. United defenders almost out on their feet. The ball into the box and Goallllllllllllll….
The sheer ecstatic joy of that moment. A moment that will live in every Coventry supporters mind forever. Their Aguero moment…

But it’s not. Because some invisible jobsworth has decided that it’s offside. Never mind that the on-field referee awarded the goal. Certainly never mind that all the evidence presented indicates that it was impossible to tell. Never mind that the system used cannot be trusted to show fine margins.
It was a perfectly beautiful goal and now it isn’t.
Football really really needs to look hard set itself.

Thought the original reason for VAR was to correct clearly, I stress clearly incorrect, such as Henry's handball goal against ROI. The current application of checking millmetres on/off side, red card review etc is bad for the officials, even worse for the fans. Needs scrapping

 

[urban genie]

I've no idea if Atwell is a Luton fan or not but if he is then Forest have every right to call that out because he shouldn't be involved in officiating a game involving one of Luton's relegation rivals. Spitty and Neville can call that Forest statement embarrassing if they want but there's a genuine whiff if he indeed supports Luton and they've been denied 3 penalties in the same game.

Atwell is a Luton fan and isn't allowed to ref their games, this is why forest claim they asked for him to be removed from VAR duty

 

[Kippax77]

It’s computer generated. It’s not a secret. Every time you see one single line instead of the normal two, it means the tolerance level has been applied.

Wow, how very ignorant of me not to understand the foolproof workings of Var.
So Rashford's full foot being offside against the dippers but deemed acceptable is comparable to a toenail being offside and deemed unacceptable in the 'tolerance levels'?
No in fact don't waste any of your precious time trying to explain, I'm still trying to get rid of the bad taste it left me from yesterday and I'm all 'varred' out.

 

[urban genie]

They possibly have a different criteria as to what constitutes “known” in regard to who referees may support.

Well if a ref declares support for a club they are barred from officiating their games which is why Attwell never refs a Luton game, Oliver a newcastle game, pawson same with the blades annd why Marriner never did villa ones, so they obviously ha a criteria.

Salisbury is undeclared, but a mate of his from college (another rag btw)works with my mate and he finds it funny when he gets their games seems just not telling is the best way to evade PGMOLs stringent checks

 

[Stephen230]

Well if a ref declares support for a club they are barred from officiating their games which is why Attwell never refs a Luton game, Oliver a newcastle game, pawson same with the blades annd why Marriner never did villa ones, so they obviously ha a criteria.

Salisbury is undeclared, but a mate of his from college (another rag btw)works with my mate and he finds it funny when he gets their games seems just not telling is the best way to evade PGMOLs stringent checks

Which is exactly what I mean by the authorities having a different criteria to people on a football forum.

If a referee comes out and declares an affinity for a team, then it’s easy. If he doesn’t, there has to be an element of trust.

Obviously if evidence surfaces of a referee in a team shirt or clearly supporting a team they claim no affinity with, then you’d expect them to step in and act.

But you can’t really expect them to act because someone has heard from a mate’s mate who went to college with them. Or no one would be allowed to referee anyone.

 

[Gorton_Tubster]

One yesterday (think it was Young) was absolutely nailed on in my book, but i dont think they even vard it

Yup it's all lost in the new terminology that VAR has brought.. not clear and obvious. High bar for fouls, technical issues.. or just plain old nobody makes the decision because they all leave it to the other. None of that existed before VAR. (Maybe high bar).

For those reasons alone it should go, but there's more. So much more that's wrong with it. And only 1 thing right with it.

 

[the-ecstacy-of-eight]

Whatever you think about the actual level of the tolerance level, it has been applied multiple times every season since then.

....but only in England and used to a different set of standards throughout the top leagues all around the entire world, and further, is it applied evenly in your opinion?

 

[pudge]

Sick to death of referees being treated like Saints you can't say 'boo' to.

Hope Forest fight it tooth and nail

 

[BlueHammer85]

@BlueHammer85 must be asleep today. No he was here this morning but declined to comment, lol

On holiday, like I can be arsed debating VAR with those who don’t want to debate - you just want an echo chamber of whinging, moaning and crying corruption against decisions you don’t like.
VAR will get decisions wrongs and never be perfect, I’ve always said it.

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

On holiday, like I can be arsed debating VAR with those who don’t want to debate - you just want an echo chamber of whinging, moaning and crying corruption against decisions you don’t like.
VAR will get decisions wrongs and never be perfect, I’ve always said it.

Why is VAR and PMGOL shrouded in secrecy , why is that Bluehammer? Why are they not open , why don't they discuss decisions in public on audio and on screen. Why is only selected audio of theor choosing released at times of their choosing. If you had nothing to hide surely you act this way as it only increases the accusations.

 

[Alan Harper's Tash]

Why is VAR and PMGOL shrouded in secrecy , why is that Bluehammer? Why are they not open , why don't they discuss decisions in public on audio and on screen. Why is only selected audio of theor choosing released at times of their choosing. If you had nothing to hide surely you act this way as it only increases the accusations.

Webb confirms FIFA have banned VAR audio being played live as Neville nails it

Howard Webb, who is in charge of refereeing body PGMOL, appeared on Monday Night Football to give an in depth explanation of how VAR works in the Premier League

www.mirror.co.uk

 

[Stephen230]

....but only in England and used to a different set of standards throughout the top leagues all around the entire world, and further, is it applied evenly in your opinion?

As far as I know, we are the only one of the top leagues still using the manual ‘drawing lines’ system.

You can argue all day about whether the lines are always being drawn in the right place. And we’ve seen from the ‘Mic’d up’ programmes that the choice of which frame to use is almost pot luck, as it seems that one either side is almost offering the exact same image to the naked eye a lot of the time.

But specifically on the point of the tolerance level. Once the computer guy has being instructed which frame to use and where exactly to measure the two lines from, it isn’t a human decision whether the tolerance level is applied. If the two lines that the computer generates were to be overlapping at all, the computer will instead just produce one line alongside an “onside” graphic.

 

[BlueHammer85]

Why is VAR and PMGOL shrouded in secrecy , why is that Bluehammer? Why are they not open , why don't they discuss decisions in public on audio and on screen. Why is only selected audio of theor choosing released at times of their choosing. If you had nothing to hide surely you act this way as it only increases the accusations.

Dunno , I don’t work for them.
Would guess any Audio released wouldn’t please anyway, just more shouts of corruptions and over analysing everything being said.

 

[Andy TheCatalyst Morrison]

Dunno , I don’t work for them.
Would guess any Audio released wouldn’t please anyway, just more shouts of corruptions and over analysing everything being said.

Can you not see how VAR is sucking the life out of the game?

 

[BlueHammer85]

Can you not see how VAR is sucking the life out of the game?

Nope, not really, just a cliche .
Very frustrating when they get it wrong but watching football is probably more entertaining than it’s ever been. Champions league games proving that lately.

 

[the-ecstacy-of-eight]

As far as I know, we are the only one of the top leagues still using the manual ‘drawing lines’ system.

You can argue all day about whether the lines are always being drawn in the right place. And we’ve seen from the ‘Mic’d up’ programmes that the choice of which frame to use is almost pot luck, as it seems that one either side is almost offering the exact same image to the naked eye a lot of the time.

But specifically on the point of the tolerance level. Once the computer guy has being instructed which frame to use and where exactly to measure the two lines from, it isn’t a human decision whether the tolerance level is applied. If the two lines that the computer generates were to be overlapping at all, the computer will instead just produce one line alongside an “onside” graphic.

....but, all of the elements I've highlighted above are 100% human judgements and decisions, and as a result the rest of the "automated process" is flawed and the automation is immaterial, it's already been contaminated by errors and possible bias.

It's a can of worms this VAR debacle.

 

[Andy TheCatalyst Morrison]

Nope, not really, just a cliche .
Very frustrating when they get it wrong but watching football is probably more entertaining than it’s ever been. Champions league games proving that lately.

Genuine question, do you go to games?

 

[Churchlawtonblue]

Webb confirms FIFA have banned VAR audio being played live as Neville nails it

Howard Webb, who is in charge of refereeing body PGMOL, appeared on Monday Night Football to give an in depth explanation of how VAR works in the Premier League

www.mirror.co.uk

First of all whwre have FIFA said this. I will only accept that explanation when i see it from the horses mouth.

Secondly if there is nothing stopping them releasing it afterwards do it for every game and in full.

The key word there is we are looking at releasing it afterwards. But still he chooses not to! . That is all you need to know. 100% ulterior motives at play in these decisions. The thing is a sham.