Referees/Officials

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flobo said:
Why do you think they are shafting us ?
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There's a number of reasons.

The semi is an easy one: The FA Cup, sponsored by Emirates, sees a team sponsored by Emirates playing in the final with the said team having drawn two non-league teams in the previous two rounds.

In the league, they want the teams that most people watch and therefore bring in the advertising revenue and sponsorship in the top four and CL and that's Liverpool, the rags and Arsenal. But there's also a definite vendetta against us because of stuff going on behind the scenes. We're trying hard to upset and topple the old order and they don't like it. The rags would be nowhere near the top four this season if there was a level playing field and the laws of the game were applied consistently and fairly.
 
CharliesRightPeg said:
According to untold arsenal referee review, we were down about 9 points in the first 16 games. Considering how well we played in the first ten, that's a massive change
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Here's a post from that site. Does anyone recognise these scenarios he's describing?

A big part of the difficulty is : how can you see if a ref is fixing a game in a certain way? And this is where it gets difficult. You first of all must know where to look. And to find such a thing you must have a bit of experience as a ref. It is not necessary but it surely helps a lot if you have experienced the power you have as a ref. If you have seen what an influence your decisions can have on players or on a team you would be amazed on how you can tilt a game.

Now the next question is: HOW do you do it? Well there are in general two options you have.

The first one is: doing it in plain sight for everyone to see. You let go flagrant fouls. You blow imaginary penalties for one team. And refuse to give the most blatant penalties for the other team. Now every spectator in the ground will see it. I could give as an example of this approach the way Webb did in the Chelsea – Manchester United game. I also could point at the way Dowd did the last hour of the Newcastle – Arsenal game last season. Where for some reason Dowd decided shortly after Arsenal had gone 0-4 in front to just let Newcastle commit the most horrendous tackles on Arsenal players without blowing it, inventing all kinds of free kicks when an Arsenal player came near a Newcastle player, inventing penalties, …

The only thing is when you do it like that you expose yourself. So refs will avoid this situation. If it isn’t completely necessary they will not make themselves look like fools. Nobody wants to look like a fool and this the same for a ref. But some persons will accept this consequence if it really is needed.

The second way of tilting a game is very difficult to see for the untrained eye. In fact I think only people who have or are refs can see it and people who have been told what to look for can see it if they pay attention.

This way is that you make sure that you stay away from big controversial decisions. You don’t invent a penalty for the team you want to give a favour. No you will make them win the game where on general a game is won: in midfield.

In fact it is a simple thing to do. You apply the rules strict for one team. And you let the rules go out of the window for the other team. Not when a blatant foul is made. When a player clearly trips a player that even a blind man can see you will give that foul. But for the rest you will let all things go you can let go. A shove in the back? Don’t blow. A push with a arm? Didn’t see it. A swing of the hip to trip a player? No, no he could have stayed on his feet. Pulling a player by the shirt? Oh, that must have been on my blind side.

Any excuse you can give is good enough. If you are a master in this you can even do it in such a way that the bad treated team feels something is wrong but doesn’t realise what is happening. The result of such an approach is that the team who is on the good side of your decisions will feel that they can almost do what they want without punishment.

The other team will get frustrated after a while. And then try to match what the team that is getting away with it, and start pushing and shoving. And then of course you will call those fouls. The more frustrated this team will get, the more fouls they will make in the game that you can punish. And thus giving time and space to the other team to reorganise themselves in defence when needed.

If you have to blow a foul that you really cannot let go you will make sure that the one team cannot take a quick free kick. You suddenly find the need to put the ball on the exact spot. Of course you don’t do this for the other team. They can take their free kick where they want.

I could go on and on for a while about the little things you can do without people really noticing it. But such an approach can be as effective as going for the big calls. It is as effective and nobody notices it.

Of course there could be times when you need to use both ways if it really doesn’t work. But a ref will not want to expose himself too much so if possible he will prefer the second way of working and only invent a penalty when it is really needed.

Now it could be that you think : this is a load of rubbish. It cannot work that way. Then I really do think that you never ever have been a ref or have watched enough football. In that case I could advise you to become a ref and do the games in the most fair way possible. And then after a few seasons you will know and understand the power a ref can have on a game.

A question you might ask yourself is: does it always work? And then I can tell you that I don’t think it will always work. The team you want to treat badly can be in such a great form that even this approach is useless. But the people for who you are doing it for and know what you are doing will have noticed your attempt in that case. I would like to add that even in the calciopoli-era in Italy the desired results did not always happened.

So this was an attempt to give you a rough impression of how to fix a game as a ref. It is up to you to keep your eyes open. The first way is easy to see. The second way is more difficult to see. But if you try, you will see it when it is happening.
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Prestwich_Blue said:
There's a number of reasons.

The semi is an easy one: The FA Cup, sponsored by Emirates, sees a team sponsored by Emirates playing in the final with the said team having drawn two non-league teams in the previous two rounds.

In the league, they want the teams that most people watch and therefore bring in the advertising revenue and sponsorship in the top four and CL and that's Liverpool, the rags and Arsenal. But there's also a definite vendetta against us because of stuff going on behind the scenes. We're trying hard to upset and topple the old order and they don't like it. The rags would be nowhere near the top four this season if there was a level playing field and the laws of the game were applied consistently and fairly.
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+1 again

Before the Chelsea game I wasn't sure I 50/50 . After the Chelsea game the following week I was talking on the phone to my friend who is a Glasgow Rangers fan and a qualified ref who said "No way can Fabregas get a yellow for that incident". Either red because his slap on Dinho was spotted at the time, or nothing and retrospective red because apart from the slap he did nothing apart from Fern pushing him backwards and then falling over the hoardings neither of which are yellow card offences. We should demand to see what the refs report said about this incident and why he received a yellow card. Add the fact that Spurs be interested in this as Fabregas won them 4 points on the next 2 games with a goal and an assist in two 1-0 wins.
 
LWashington said:
+1 again

Before the Chelsea game I wasn't sure I 50/50 . After the Chelsea game the following week I was talking on the phone to my friend who is a Glasgow Rangers fan and a qualified ref who said "No way can Fabregas get a yellow for that incident". Either red because his slap on Dinho was spotted at the time, or nothing and retrospective red because apart from the slap he did nothing apart from Fern pushing him backwards and then falling over the hoardings neither of which are yellow card offences. We should demand to see what the refs report said about this incident and why he received a yellow card. Add the fact that Spurs be interested in this as Fabregas won them 4 points on the next 2 games with a goal and an assist in two 1-0 wins.
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Fabregas didn't get a yellow card for it, did he? Chalobah got a yellow for shoving Aguero to the ground and thus starting it all.
The PL panel of 3 reviewed Fabregas and couldn't agree unanimously that it was a sending off offence.
 
MillionMilesAway said:
Fabregas didn't get a yellow card for it, did he? Chalobah got a yellow for shoving Aguero to the ground and thus starting it all.
The PL panel of 3 reviewed Fabregas and couldn't agree unanimously that it was a sending off offence.
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jd8yrqN.jpg




From the BBC website as I was watching the game, apologies if you are correct and I'm mistaken.

Then again I would ask for transparancy and say who the hell was on a panel and think a slap in the face isn't worth a Red as they should never be on a panel again.
 
LWashington said:
jd8yrqN.jpg




From the BBC website as I was watching the game, apologies if you are correct and I'm mistaken.

Then again I would ask for transparancy and say who the hell was on a panel and think a slap in the face isn't worth a Red as they should never be on a panel again.
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Fair enough, I thought he didn't as it got reviewed. Maybe he got something for something else at the time.

And yes, that three man panel decision is baffling.
http://www.thefa.com/news/2016/dec/05/manchester-city-chelsea-051216
 
MillionMilesAway said:
Fair enough, I thought he didn't as it got reviewed. Maybe he got something for something else at the time.

And yes, that three man panel decision is baffling.
http://www.thefa.com/news/2016/dec/05/manchester-city-chelsea-051216
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Yes just read it and you are correct also. So apologies again. The bit in bold however stands as striking or attempting to strike an opponent is a red card . Who did this needs sacking.

http://www.express.co.uk/sport/foot...ter-City-angry-column-FA-decision-Fernandinho

“Off the ball incidents which are not seen at the time by the match officials are referred to a panel of three former elite referees. Each referee panel member will review the video footage independently of one another to determine whether they consider it a sending-off offence.

“For retrospective action to be taken and an FA charge to follow, the decision of the panel must be unanimous.”

So was it one “elite” referee who said: “Nothing wrong with that slap, lads. Good honest fun,” was it two, or all three? Either way, how is striking another player on the face not a “sending-off offence”?
 
LWashington said:
Yes just read it and you are correct also. So apologies again. The bit in bold however stands as striking or attempting to strike an opponent is a red card . Who did this needs sacking.

http://www.express.co.uk/sport/foot...ter-City-angry-column-FA-decision-Fernandinho

“Off the ball incidents which are not seen at the time by the match officials are referred to a panel of three former elite referees. Each referee panel member will review the video footage independently of one another to determine whether they consider it a sending-off offence.

“For retrospective action to be taken and an FA charge to follow, the decision of the panel must be unanimous.”

So was it one “elite” referee who said: “Nothing wrong with that slap, lads. Good honest fun,” was it two, or all three? Either way, how is striking another player on the face not a “sending-off offence”?
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Quite!

We were both right (ish).
 
LWashington said:
Yes just read it and you are correct also. So apologies again. The bit in bold however stands as striking or attempting to strike an opponent is a red card . Who did this needs sacking.

http://www.express.co.uk/sport/foot...ter-City-angry-column-FA-decision-Fernandinho

“Off the ball incidents which are not seen at the time by the match officials are referred to a panel of three former elite referees. Each referee panel member will review the video footage independently of one another to determine whether they consider it a sending-off offence.

“For retrospective action to be taken and an FA charge to follow, the decision of the panel must be unanimous.”

So was it one “elite” referee who said: “Nothing wrong with that slap, lads. Good honest fun,” was it two, or all three? Either way, how is striking another player on the face not a “sending-off offence”?
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Because the decision has to be unanimous it only takes one nay sayer to negate any further action. Easy to manipulate.
 
I'm actually thinking about writing a book that will discuss the referee's and such hoping to expose these issues.

These fucking twats needs to be taken down a notch.
 
LWashington said:
+1 again

Before the Chelsea game I wasn't sure I 50/50 . After the Chelsea game the following week I was talking on the phone to my friend who is a Glasgow Rangers fan and a qualified ref who said "No way can Fabregas get a yellow for that incident". Either red because his slap on Dinho was spotted at the time, or nothing and retrospective red because apart from the slap he did nothing apart from Fern pushing him backwards and then falling over the hoardings neither of which are yellow card offences. We should demand to see what the refs report said about this incident and why he received a yellow card. Add the fact that Spurs be interested in this as Fabregas won them 4 points on the next 2 games with a goal and an assist in two 1-0 wins.
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And the frightening thing about that article is that they've given up all pretence or subtlety and resorted to the route 1, blindingly obvious decisions this season.
 
Prestwich_Blue said:
There's a number of reasons.

The semi is an easy one: The FA Cup, sponsored by Emirates, sees a team sponsored by Emirates playing in the final with the said team having drawn two non-league teams in the previous two rounds.

In the league, they want the teams that most people watch and therefore bring in the advertising revenue and sponsorship in the top four and CL and that's Liverpool, the rags and Arsenal. But there's also a definite vendetta against us because of stuff going on behind the scenes. We're trying hard to upset and topple the old order and they don't like it. The rags would be nowhere near the top four this season if there was a level playing field and the laws of the game were applied consistently and fairly.
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The reason Rags /Lfc are so popular is massive free positive publicity/cheerleading from the media for 40--50 yrs...They don't want us to grow our fanbase(neutrals becoming City fans)..everything we do as a negative spin on it...The amount of money in football would not be reduced if City had more positive publicity..that's an excuse by the media to continue to be anti City & pro Utd/Lfc/Afc
 
silvasankle said:
I'm actually thinking about writing a book that will discuss the referee's and such hoping to expose these issues.

These fucking twats needs to be taken down a notch.
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If it could be proven, they need more than taking down a notch. Influencing the outcome of a game by underhand means is basically fraud however you choose to dress it up. Considering the amount of money involved (£2M merit based earnings per league position alone; not including any image rights/TV fees/advertising revenue etc.), it is high level fraud.
 
Prestwich_Blue said:
Here's a post from that site. Does anyone recognise these scenarios he's describing?
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That's one of my favourite quotes. Underwood is a prat about certain stuff and I think some bluemooners fell out with him over Ffp, but for his work on refs I think he deserves some kudos. He's always going to get some stuff wrong but at least he's trying and I'd love for city to bring in a team from Germany or similar to go through all of the matches we've played
 
The day that we will get a ref that is in our favour from the start of the match to end of it, will be the day that hell freezes over. As that is not likely to happen any time soon, I suggest fellow blues that we better get use to all the ref's being anti City.

With Martin Atkinson due to be the ref for the derby on Thursday, I am already expecting him to give the rags a penalty should they be either losing or drawing so that they can either get in front of us or stay the same points behind us. There is no way that I can see him letting us win this game.
 
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