COVID-19 — Coronavirus

[Healdplace]

Of the 82 England hospital deaths today they were aged between 35 and 97 and 8 of them aged between 49 and 94 had no previous underlying conditions.

Those exceptions to the usual all old folk with know conditions is becoming more visibly numerous daily.

Might shake up a few of those invulnerable younger folk partying like there is no tomorrow into realising that might literally be true for some of them too.

 

[The Light Was Yellow Sir]

I see some of that, but what about say a 55 year old, overweight, maybe diabetic maybe an at risk ethnicity with a mortgage and family to keep. Unless we pay these people and say their job is safe they aren’t going to stay at home. Even if we do that how many of these people are working as health workers or carers, teachers, other essential workers, can we afford them to all stay at home? What about the self employed with business bills to pay?
Who decides who is vulnerable who isn’t to qualify for support ?
Saying protect the vulnerable or the vulnerable protect themselves is way easier said than done.
.

But paying him to stay at home for six months must be cheaper than what we’ve done?

Heres a Covid risk calculator https://www.coronavirusrisk.org/

 

[Chippy_boy]

You just need to give people the facts and let them decide what they’re going to do. Biggest risk of death is age, then it’s age plus being poorer, then it’s age, being poorer and having co-morbidities.
Some of the worse conditions to have are: cancer, chronic kidney disease, COPD, being a solid organ transplant recipient, diabetes, being fat and smoking fags. Dementia is often listed on the death certificates as a contributory cause.

People need to consider how many of the above apply to them and work out their level of risk before deciding on going out.
If you’re under 70, aren’t enormous, don’t smoke and don’t have any of the conditions I’ve listed, you’ll probably be ok going out.

Of course, if you’re 85 and got lots of those things you were at enormous risk before coronavirus but your death wouldn’t have made the news..

Whilst I agree with what you say, unfortunately a very large proportion of the UK population are too damned stupid to be trusted to make the right life (or death) defining decisions!

 

[Scottyboi]

Asia and Africa seem to have come out of this really well so far.

Was reading that our message of washing your hands was the wrong point to focus on, if it had been masks we could have reduced the first wave immensely. The Asian countries that have done well use masks as a first port of call.

 

[True_Blue69]

0.1% for alot of people

Less than that for under 50's

 

[The Light Was Yellow Sir]

That's pretty damning, why are no politicians mentioning this?

They’d have to spend 3 minutes looking for the data!

 

[True_Blue69]

Attempting to return to normality now will fail.

Probably 50 million people will fall sick and a quarter of a million will die.

Our hospitals will be full of covid patients for months.

Whatever you call this scenario, "normality" it is not.

50 million will fall sick, are you serious. There are only 68 million people or something in the country and looking at Manchester Uni recently 90% were asymptomatic. Unless you are talking worldwide of course which would probably be about right.

 

[Healdplace]

Spokesperson for Boris - about to do a live press conference any moment - says he is not goung to do a circuit breaker right now.

Later is too late.

And worse for lives and livelihoods as it will have to be for longer then.

So he has to either say now or never. Not maybe in three weeks when the deaths get too bad for me to run away from,

 

[The Light Was Yellow Sir]

Whilst I agree with what you say, unfortunately a very large proportion of the UK population are too damned stupid to be trusted to make the right life (or death) defining decisions!

Thats always been true. 50% of cancers are preventable but the numbers keep going up and up. It’s the human condition.

 

[blueparrot]

But paying him to stay at home for six months must be cheaper than what we’ve done?

Heres a Covid risk calculator https://www.coronavirusrisk.org/

Not if his job still needs doing. Lets say I’m his employer do I manage without him for 6 months ,maybe there’s a few I have to do without. Or do I try and employ some people not vulnerable, what if they aren’t as qualified. In 6 months does he get his job back? Throwing out those that covered?

 

[True_Blue69]

I agree.

If there was no hope of a vaccine in sight, or ever, then the "let it rip" proposals would have to be considered more seriously, because as pretty much everyone agrees, we cannot stay in semi or permanent lockdown forever.

But we are not in that place. A viable vaccine is very likely not that far off, and with it, a hope of a return to something vaguely normal. So no need for drastic and highly risks changes of course IMO.

Yes, many businesses will have gone bust by then and that is a tragedy for all concerned. But things WILL bounce back quite quickly. People will still want to go to the cinema even if Cineworld don't own it any more and some new start up does. Ditto bars, restaurants etc. The jobs will return.

I think that's the key isn't it, the vaccine being within sight. If it wasn't we would have no option really other than 'let it rip'. Whilst that's in touching distance then some form of lockdown is a no brainer really, just needs to be sensible.

 

[The Light Was Yellow Sir]

Not if his job still needs doing. Lets say I’m his employer do I manage without him for 6 months ,maybe there’s a few I have to do without. Or do I try and employ some people not vulnerable, what if they aren’t as qualified. In 6 months does he get his job back? Throwing out those that covered?

If you close his business and he can never get a job he’s totally buggered any way.....

 

[Healdplace]

Cases in GM have doubled in last 2 weeks he says. The situation is grave there. There will be more in ICUs in Manchester soon than in April. Says Boris.

Will not shut down businesses in Cornwall because Manchester has to 'unless I absolutely have to' do this nationally.

 

[blueparrot]

If you close his business and he can never get a job he’s totally buggered any way.....

I’m not saying there is a good solution, just saying protect the vulnerable and cary on is a great sounding idea but too simplistic, and far too complicated to be a realistic and practical solution. While we are hoping for a vaccine in the next few months. If the hopes of a vaccine change then the situation changes and we might have to change direction anddo that.

 

[Healdplace]

1657, 3019, 1888, 1542, 1845, 941, 1455, 1533, 1445, 1521, 1515, 1619 are the last 12 days GM totals which are apparently doubling Boris has just claimed.

I must not be very good at maths as that does not look anything like what I call doubling. (The 3000 was the day they added all the cases they lost btw).

It is not falling but it is pretty obviously not escalating rapidly either.

 

[True_Blue69]

Just seen breaking news that a German court has overturned Berlin's curfew on bars and restaurants. Says the moves were disproportionate. Hopefully we can do the same here, we all know Germany are the ones to follow and have handled this better than anyone else. Somme common sense creeping in at last.

 

[The Light Was Yellow Sir]

I’m not saying there is a good solution, just saying protect the vulnerable and cary on is a great sounding idea but too simplistic, and far too complicated to be a realistic and practical solution. While we are hoping for a vaccine in the next few months. If the hopes of a vaccine change then the situation changes and we might have to change direction anddo that.

But if he knows he’s vulnerable, he needs to ensure he is always socially distant, wears a mask when he’s out, washes his hands and goes into Covid secure environments, is more likely what he needs to do, rather than being ‘locked away’.

 

[SiMCFC]

It wont be unproven , it will proven effective and safe , it has been done in record time because every scientist in the world was working on finding and testing potential ones, take no notice of china and russia already injecting their citizens , theirs is not tested properly and their population have no choice in the matter , ours will be as safe as the flu vaccine

It is impossible to know what the long term affects could/will be though from both the virus and the vaccine that is my only worry. It happened with MMR and it's happened with many others, until there is a better data set which can only come with time I wouldn't personally feel it was right to 'test' it out on a child.

 

[Scottyboi]

 

[The Light Was Yellow Sir]

1657, 3019, 1888, 1542, 1845, 941, 1455, 1533, 1445, 1521, 1515, 1619 are the last 12 days GM totals which are apparently doubling Boris has just claimed.

I must not be very good at maths as that does not look anything like what I call doubling. (The 3000 was the day they added all the cases they lost btw).

It is not falling but it is pretty obviously not escalating rapidly either.

It’s not and this is the source of my frustrations. There’s no need for them to make stuff up and I will wager nobody will call them out on it.
GM hospital admissions less today than yesterday, ventilator beds up by 3.