I'm not sure your post makes any sense. If they'd gone on loan and not played how is that better than training with our first team and not playing? There's no guarantees that they'd play more on loan than they will here, as shown by your own examples.But I wasn’t suggesting that they should be with our first team, I was pointing out that sticking around whilst they could have been on loan didn’t really do they any favours. Just look at Mount, Gallagher and James at Chelsea - all went on loan at 18 and are all now England internationals and PL regulars.
Those 3 are a very small percentage of the numerous players Chelsea have had out on loan and how many Chelsea PL match day squads/teams did they appear on at James' age. There is too much we don't know about to make comparisons. Each player will be put on a path that City believe is best for club and player, sometimes the player and/or his advisers may not see it the same way and we as supporters have to accept that reality, if it happens.But I wasn’t suggesting that they should be with our first team, I was pointing out that sticking around whilst they could have been on loan didn’t really do they any favours. Just look at Mount, Gallagher and James at Chelsea - all went on loan at 18 and are all now England internationals and PL regulars.
I'm not sure your post makes any sense. If they'd gone on loan and not played how is that better than training with our first team and not playing? There's no guarantees that they'd play more on loan than they will here, as shown by your own examples.
Felix Nmecha wasn't going to make it here regardless, he's far too inconsistent and he can't use his physique in the mens game like he could against youth teams.
I'd imagine Foden being subbed and Walker walking, together with Leipzig being ahead, impacted substantially on Pep's use of the youngsters.Said it earlier, but he needs a loan move. He isn’t going to play for us this season. Not enough anyway to develop
last night was so disappointing. Game that meant nothing and still didn’t play him
Can't imagine Foden treatment into first team integration also cause an uproar in here, this place must be very calm when Pep didn't play much Foden in his first season for the first team.
Foden first got on City's bench as a 16 year old. Very different ages / expectations.
McAtee needs to play as a 19 year old.
McAtee when he turned 19: 1 appearanceCan't imagine Foden treatment into first team integration also cause an uproar in here, this place must be very calm when Pep didn't play much Foden in his first season for the first team.
I think the fact Foden played about 300 mins all season with the 1st team when he got his callup at first rather than by age/games, would have seen the same meltdown as with McAtee.McAtee when he turned 19: 1 appearance
Foden when he turned 19: 36 appearances, 7 goals
Once again.I think the fact Foden played about 300 mins all season with the 1st team when he got his callup at first rather than by age/games, would have seen the same meltdown as with McAtee.
Foden first season 328 minutes (1st Team) and the rest in the EDS
Palmer first season 314 minutes (1st Team) and the rest in the EDS
McAtee has been moved up quicker than planned due to the contract situation as well (I think the plan was he was inline for the above next season).
So I assume at 17 Foden was a better player than Palmer or Mcatee at 17. Players develop at different ages. It isn’t just about ability either it will be about behaviour and maturity around the first team squad, again people mature at different rates. Only those around these players every day can really know when they are ready for more minutes.Once again.
Foden, in his first season, was 17.
McAtee and Palmer are both 19.
I'm comparing the play time at the stage of development, age is irrelevant. When both at the EDS/1st team step stage they were both given a similar amount of time. Not every player is going to be ready at 17, or 18 or 19.. but so far when they take that step they have been treated similarly.Once again.
Foden, in his first season, was 17.
McAtee and Palmer are both 19.
To be fair, I agree with all of this.So I assume at 17 Foden was a better player than Palmer or Mcatee at 17. Players develop at different ages. It isn’t just about ability either it will be about behaviour and maturity around the first team squad, again people mature at different rates. Only those around these players every day can really know when they are ready for more minutes.
I don't think age is irrelevant. If a player was still in the academy at 22 or 23 without making any significant first team appearances, would age still be irrelevant? Would he be at the "same stage of development" as McAtee right now?I'm comparing the play time at the stage of development, age is irrelevant. When both at the EDS/1st team step stage they were both given a similar amount of time. Not every player is going to be ready at 17, or 18 or 19.. but so far when they take that step they have been treated similarly.
Think Palmer and Mcatee. are very different cases, I’d expect Palmer is happy with his game time, and has signed a contract. Mcatee may or may not, but we can’t play him just so he signs a contract he’s either ready or he isn’t. Mcatee is unfortunate he’s trying to get minutes in a position where there are a lot of players in front of him.To be fair, I agree with all of this.
I'm not concerned than Palmer or McAtee aren't good enough, far from it. Nor am I worried that Pep I am concerned that we will not be able to keep hold of players this good by giving them pitiful minutes when they are old enough to play regular football. You can get away with giving a 17 year old 300 minutes, but a 19 year old? They will be expecting more. Palmer and McAtee will look at Foden, the player they have been shown as the only current example of the youth system working and wonder why they are getting fewer minutes than Foden was, who was 2 years younger than they are.
I don't think age is irrelevant. If a player was still in the academy at 22 or 23 without making any significant first team appearances, would age still be irrelevant? Would he be at the "same stage of development" as McAtee right now?
Foden was promoted far earlier in his development than Palmer, you can call it the "same stage of development" but that is disingenuous. Foden never got to the point of dominating youth team football that Palmer and McAtee have gotten to because by the time Foden was their age he was a bonafide first teamer.
Yeah, agreed but in comparing them at the first step up i can see the pathway they seem to be working too. Getting to 21/22 would be ridiculous for them not to have made that step already etc.I don't think age is irrelevant. If a player was still in the academy at 22 or 23 without making any significant first team appearances, would age still be irrelevant? Would he be at the "same stage of development" as McAtee right now?
Foden was promoted far earlier in his development than Palmer, you can call it the "same stage of development" but that is disingenuous. Foden never got to the point of dominating youth team football that Palmer and McAtee have gotten to because by the time Foden was their age he was a bonafide first teamer.
clearly not if Pep has anything to say about. Rangnick in 2 games has shown more interest in developing young talent than Pep has in 5 years, Foden excluded.Foden was a project,he was immensely talented but he was also the Academy poster boy.The club ensured,alongside that natural ability,he was wrapped in cotton wool and all but guaranteed the progression.
Now that criteria has been met/the mission accomplished,and with our first team of purchased superstars......i'm not convinced the same time and effort will be allocated to others.
c
clearly not if Pep has anything to say about. Rangnick in 2 games has shown more interest in developing young talent than Pep has in 5 years, Foden excluded.
just peeved at Pep's antics on Tuesday. Palmer & McAtee should have started and it does us no favours not to give our youngsters opportunities.That's a bit harsh don't you think?
Alot of us assume our youngster have a reguler starter quality like Foden, while they just might be a squad member at best. Truth is i don't know a single thing about judging someone potential, while i can see from my own eyes that they looked good enogh to play in EDS. Pep and city coaching staff may see them differently than me.