Thornbury is as big a clown as Abbot. She has regularly made an absolute bell end of herself on question time, perhaps most memorably her announcement that Labour would seek a 'deal' from the EU, bring it back to the country and then campaign against it
I'm afraid that your party now encapsulates the views you state, and will never win elections because of them.
The likes of Starmer and Thornberry have spent the last 42 months condescending to working class folk, and have made
the same, or definitely inferred, similar comments that their voters have been 'Brainwashed into Brexit support.' Also, these people are not going to
all of a sudden vote for someone because it's a woman, from the north, again it's another example of identity politics, that has
infested the party, Johnson could not be more different, yet has gained the votes of these people, and in enormous numbers.
They simply have to recruit someone who is for Brexit, it's happening, remain is dead, gone, and yet we're still hearing the same
arguments against it, 'Brexit will be a problem' etc; Whether it will or not, is now irrelevant, the fact is we're getting it.
Thornberry has just been on TV, listening to her, with mounting incredulity, telling everyone that black and white, is really pink and green,
and was still waffling claptrap about confirmatory referendums, was unbelievable.
Labour now, with the candidates being offered up, are done for.
That policy - put forward as 'pragmatic and democratic' by Starmer and Thornberry in particular - was such a massive insult to the Labour Leave supporters.
It basically said - we want to Remain but need to say something that sounds like we are balanced. Let's adopt this policy and get a shit deal from the EU and then a Remain vote will be guaranteed - those thick northern twats won't realise what we are doing
Agree entirely.When they announced it I did say it was a mature approach on here but at that time I didn’t know they would actively campaign against it.
It turned out to be utter disastrous and almost as bad as the revoke policy the Liberals pushed, which again I was wrong on as I thought it would see them replace Labour as one of the big two, with Brexit being so polarising.
In the end, even as someone who voted to remain, I didn’t like it as a policy as you could just see it not ever going away, if the unthinkable happened and the Liberals won a majority.
Thinking about it more and more, whilst the topic has been very close to 50/50 with the public. Leave tends to win more constituencies in a FPTP system, due to how it’s spread and where it’s popular. I don’t think Labour could have done anything but campaign to leave to try and win.
I agree with some of your points here. But it is almost like you want Labour to be silent on brexit and not challenge the government on anything it does. Brexit will do nothing for the working class communities that voted for it - Zero. It will be very damaging for our economy and lots of decent jobs will be lost. That reality is what Boris will have to answer to and it is the job of the opposition to hold him to account and ensure that the consequences are understood. Labour don't need to keep re-running 2016 but they do need to ensure that those that started and will now implement this shit show own it. Brexit will be a problem for the foreseeable future and Boris does not deserve a free pass on it.
You are running the same age old argument which is Brexit will be bad and is a mistake. This isn't offering an alternative or opposition, you are telling people why they are wrong to want Brexit but that argument was lost nearly 4 years ago.
Opposing isn't about arguing to change peoples demands, opposing is about offering a better alternative that includes those same demands.
If Labour go back to banging on about how FoM is good, CU is necessary etc then they just quite simply haven't learnt what people want Brexit to be.
Agree entirely.
Most MPs I think were genuine in their statements that they respected the result of the referendum, but clearly we found it very difficult to find any particular version of Brexit that a majority of them could support. So I can kind of understand how we were stuck.
However, the GE changed that. So whilst it was vaguely defendable to have voted against May's WA in previous parliamentary votes, I can see no moral justification at all for campaigning for another referendum or even for saying you'd vote against it in such a referendum. That was just wrong and the public pretty broadly seem to have thought so as well.
Again, agree entirely. What on earth was the point of people voting to "take back control" and then signing us up to rules and regulations we cannot control???!The Tories could have put up the ‘unicorn’ deal promised by Liam Fox and Johnson prior to 2016 and Labour would have said it was poor and voted it down.
I don’t get the sentiment about ‘dropping workers rights regulations’ and other things the EU protects etc. The whole point of leaving is so we can form our own regulations and laws, if the public hate what the Tories do, they can get rid in 5 years.
People buy from people as the old expression goes. And therefore being "likeable" is a very important attribute, and for me, she has that. Stridence and arrogance are not appealing attributes (note to self, need to do better here!) which are all too common amongst front bench politicians.
This comes from the mindset that brexit will get done at the end of January and that will be it - nothing more to do. Brexit is essentially a decade minimum of renegotiating trade deals. With all of these negotiations there will be give and take. Boris would love a free pass and no scrutiny and for us to all look the other way when it turns to shit. When FoM and the CU are dropped their will be implications and the Tories have never been straight about them. The idea that this is a no go subject for Labour is rediculous - some people might not want to hear it but leavers will need to own it. That includes former labour leavers - now tory leavers accepting that the tories delivered brexit and it was shit. That will be the landscape of the next GE.
There wont be a by- election for ages though. Only way that will happen is if they sacrifice one of their existing MPs on health reasons or to spend time with the family or some such excuse. Would look pretty cynical reallyShe was sat with a tory around the same age...they were getting on with each other (think they may have penned a piece together). Felt a bit refreshing for that lack of bile and the addition of common ground rather than being polar opposites that must snarl at each other. Definitely likeable, which is v rare for a politician it seems these days.
The 'people buy from people'...many might think he's a giant **** but Boris has that bit of charm as evident in his Mayor days...personality at the very least.
Matt Hancock on the other evident couldn't sell me a drop of water if I was deathly parched.
Still think we're talking about a huge rebuild here though and momentum do not seem to be giving it up. Not that he would perhaps want the gig (and I've already mentioned him), but if the labour earth is scorched D. Milliband could be a strong option...?
Funnily enough you don't have to be an MP to be a minister or even to be PM, but I would guess to be leader of the opposition, you probably do?There wont be a by- election for ages though. Only way that will happen is if they sacrifice one of their existing MPs on health reasons or to spend time with the family or some such excuse. Would look pretty cynical really
Good point. Maybe not, but to be effective you probably have to be an MP, practically speaking like.Funnily enough you don't have to be an MP to be a minister or even to be PM, but I would guess to be leader of the opposition, you probably do?
Well, that’s all predicated on your opinion,I agree with some of your points here. But it is almost like you want Labour to be silent on brexit and not challenge the government on anything it does. Brexit will do nothing for the working class communities that voted for it - Zero. It will be very damaging for our economy and lots of decent jobs will be lost. That reality is what Boris will have to answer to and it is the job of the opposition to hold him to account and ensure that the consequences are understood. Labour don't need to keep re-running 2016 but they do need to ensure that those that started and will now implement this shit show own it. Brexit will be a problem for the foreseeable future and Boris does not deserve a free pass on it.
Again, agree entirely. What on earth was the point of people voting to "take back control" and then signing us up to rules and regulations we cannot control???!
I get why Labour supporter think this is a big deal and everyone is going to get shafted, but I really don't see it like that. I don't think the Tories have any intention of eroding workers' rights, i just don't think we can allow ourselves to be bound by future laws over which we can have no influence nor control. That would be madness IMO.
I don't think the likes of Bigga or IfIwasonly... will ever be happy mate. Not until we have a modern day Lenin as PM, i.e. never.It’s been confirmed today that our workers rights, whilst not “signing up” to the EU’s, will be largely the same anyway, we just will do it without being under their regulations.
So there, everybody happy.
I've got a Nigerian prince I'd like to introduce you too, might be able to make you some easy money?It’s been confirmed today that our workers rights, whilst not “signing up” to the EU’s, will be largely the same anyway, we just will do it without being under their regulations.
So there, everybody happy.
Wasn't self determination one of the main reasons for Brexit?I've got a Nigerian prince I'd like to introduce you too, might be able to make you some easy money?
Yes, and anyone who thinks Boris Johnson is going to self determine us in a manner that doesn't completely screw over the working men and women in this country is deluding themselves.Wasn't self determination one of the main reasons for Brexit?